How to enter ETF transactions into Q

I have a Gold ETF. During the year, no transactions for this ETF were on my
brokerage statements.

But on my 1099-B detail for this ETF (one month example):

Date Sold = 5/31/09, Qty = 0, Proceeds = 30.87, Cost Basis = 29.33,
Gain/Loss = 1.54

It also section called Proceeds Investment Expenses - Detail Information

Date = 5/31/09, Amount = 30.87-


I was told I could claim the 30.87 as investment expense. Also, the cost
basis for this position was reduced by the 29.33.

How do I enter a transaction in Q which will reduce my cost basis by 29.33,
show with a capital gain of 1.54 for 0 shares and investment expense of
30.87
without affecting the number of shares and money in my account?

In alt.comp.software.financial.quicken, Art Matz wrote:

>I have a Gold ETF. During the year, no transactions for this ETF were on my
>brokerage statements.
>
>But on my 1099-B detail for this ETF (one month example):
>
>Date Sold = 5/31/09, Qty = 0, Proceeds = 30.87, Cost Basis = 29.33,
>Gain/Loss = 1.54
>
>It also section called Proceeds Investment Expenses - Detail Information
>
>Date = 5/31/09, Amount = 30.87-
>
>
> I was told I could claim the 30.87 as investment expense. Also, the cost
>basis for this position was reduced by the 29.33.

Not in the US for most people... OK, you could claim it, but it
would be subject to a threshold that makes it have no effect for
most people.
http://www.schwab.com/public/schwab/...eductible.html


>
>How do I enter a transaction in Q which will reduce my cost basis by 29.33,
>show with a capital gain of 1.54 for 0 shares and investment expense of
>30.87
>without affecting the number of shares and money in my account?

That's messy.
Enter a return of capital, plus a miscellaneous expense? No, that's
not quite it. OK. Maybe do an appropriate split to give you a little
more than you have now, and sell the extra for 30.87... that's in
addition to the miscellaneous expense transaction.

I would be tempted to Sell that sucker, to avoid annual aggravation.

I will probably sell this position. If I do buy shares of this again,
only in an IRA where I wouldn't have to worry about these consequences.

From what I've looked up, they sell gold in the fund each month to cover
expenses.

They report the sale of gold as proceeds which you don't actually get since
it's used to pay expenses.

I have to pay tax on the gains. My cost basis goes down by my cost basis in
the gold they sold.

But, unless I itemize (I usually take the standard deduction), I'm penalized
by my cost basis going down with no offsetting benefit.
"Targ" <> wrote in message
news:...
> In alt.comp.software.financial.quicken, Art Matz wrote:
>
>>I have a Gold ETF. During the year, no transactions for this ETF were on
>>my
>>brokerage statements.
>>
>>But on my 1099-B detail for this ETF (one month example):
>>
>>Date Sold = 5/31/09, Qty = 0, Proceeds = 30.87, Cost Basis = 29.33,
>>Gain/Loss = 1.54
>>
>>It also section called Proceeds Investment Expenses - Detail Information
>>
>>Date = 5/31/09, Amount = 30.87-
>>
>>
>> I was told I could claim the 30.87 as investment expense. Also, the cost
>>basis for this position was reduced by the 29.33.
>
> Not in the US for most people... OK, you could claim it, but it
> would be subject to a threshold that makes it have no effect for
> most people.
> http://www.schwab.com/public/schwab/...eductible.html
>
>
>>
>>How do I enter a transaction in Q which will reduce my cost basis by
>>29.33,
>>show with a capital gain of 1.54 for 0 shares and investment expense of
>>30.87
>>without affecting the number of shares and money in my account?
>
> That's messy.
> Enter a return of capital, plus a miscellaneous expense? No, that's
> not quite it. OK. Maybe do an appropriate split to give you a little
> more than you have now, and sell the extra for 30.87... that's in
> addition to the miscellaneous expense transaction.
>
> I would be tempted to Sell that sucker, to avoid annual aggravation.
>

On Mar 4, 9:59*am, "Art Matz" <am...@invalid.com> wrote:
> * * I will probably sell this position. If I do buy shares of this again,
> only in an IRA where I wouldn't have to worry about these consequences.
>
> From what I've looked up, they sell gold in the fund each month to cover
> expenses.
>
> They report the sale of gold as proceeds which you don't actually get since
> it's used to pay expenses.
>
> I have to pay tax on the gains. My cost basis goes down by my cost basis in
> the gold they sold.
>
> But, unless I itemize (I usually take the standard deduction), I'm penalized
> by my cost basis going down with no offsetting benefit."Targ" <n...@mail.invalid> wrote in message
>
> news:...
>
> > In alt.comp.software.financial.quicken, Art Matz wrote:
>
> >>I have a Gold ETF. During the year, no transactions for this ETF were on
> >>my
> >>brokerage statements.
>
> >>But on my 1099-B detail for this ETF (one month example):
>
> >>Date Sold = 5/31/09, *Qty = 0, *Proceeds = 30.87, Cost Basis = 29.33,
> >>Gain/Loss = 1.54
>
> >>It also section called Proceeds Investment Expenses - Detail Information
>
> >>Date = 5/31/09, Amount = 30.87-
>
> >> *I was told I could claim the 30.87 as investment expense. Also, thecost
> >>basis for this position was reduced by the 29.33.
>
> > Not in the US for most people... OK, you could claim it, but it
> > would be subject to a threshold that makes it have no effect for
> > most people.
> >http://www.schwab.com/public/schwab/.../market_insigh...
>
> >>How do I enter a transaction in Q which will reduce my cost basis by
> >>29.33,
> >>show with a capital gain of 1.54 for 0 shares and investment expense of
> >>30.87
> >>without affecting the number of shares and money in my account?
>
> > That's messy.
> > Enter a return of capital, plus a miscellaneous expense? No, that's
> > not quite it. OK. Maybe do an appropriate split to give you a little
> > more than you have now, and sell the extra for 30.87... that's in
> > addition to the miscellaneous expense transaction.
>
> > I would be tempted to Sell that sucker, to avoid annual aggravation.

Yes, there's really no good way to deal with this unless you go back
into Quicken and convert your shares into ounces of gold, which would
have other ramifications when it came to daily pricing.

In the SPDR write-up (http://www.spdrgoldshares.com/media/GLD/file/
SPDR-Gold-Trust-Tax-Information-2009.pdf) they are somewhat
inconsistent in their approach to the calculations, but the "Proceeds"
from sales *should* be the same as the "Investment Expense" so that
would leave you with no cash effect, just a slightly smaller number of
ounces of gold. Maybe do a "stock split" to convert to ounces, sell
your ounces, then do a "reverse split" to come back to your original
number of shares?

I haven't received any 1099 info on this but I've read that other
folks who own GLD have received 1099's with each month's sale listed
out as a transaction, meaning each one of those really should be
entered in your tax return. What fun!

Yeah, these sort of things really should be inside an IRA.

Tom Young

Yes, my 1099 has monthly amounts since I bought it.
"TomYoung" <> wrote in message
news:d8c3d4bb-2921-43f5-bbc3-...
On Mar 4, 9:59 am, "Art Matz" <am...@invalid.com> wrote:
> I will probably sell this position. If I do buy shares of this again,
> only in an IRA where I wouldn't have to worry about these consequences.
>
> From what I've looked up, they sell gold in the fund each month to cover
> expenses.
>
> They report the sale of gold as proceeds which you don't actually get
> since
> it's used to pay expenses.
>
> I have to pay tax on the gains. My cost basis goes down by my cost basis
> in
> the gold they sold.
>
> But, unless I itemize (I usually take the standard deduction), I'm
> penalized
> by my cost basis going down with no offsetting benefit."Targ"
> <n...@mail.invalid> wrote in message
>
> news:...
>
> > In alt.comp.software.financial.quicken, Art Matz wrote:
>
> >>I have a Gold ETF. During the year, no transactions for this ETF were on
> >>my
> >>brokerage statements.
>
> >>But on my 1099-B detail for this ETF (one month example):
>
> >>Date Sold = 5/31/09, Qty = 0, Proceeds = 30.87, Cost Basis = 29.33,
> >>Gain/Loss = 1.54
>
> >>It also section called Proceeds Investment Expenses - Detail Information
>
> >>Date = 5/31/09, Amount = 30.87-
>
> >> I was told I could claim the 30.87 as investment expense. Also, the
> >> cost
> >>basis for this position was reduced by the 29.33.
>
> > Not in the US for most people... OK, you could claim it, but it
> > would be subject to a threshold that makes it have no effect for
> > most people.
> >http://www.schwab.com/public/schwab/.../market_insigh...
>
> >>How do I enter a transaction in Q which will reduce my cost basis by
> >>29.33,
> >>show with a capital gain of 1.54 for 0 shares and investment expense of
> >>30.87
> >>without affecting the number of shares and money in my account?
>
> > That's messy.
> > Enter a return of capital, plus a miscellaneous expense? No, that's
> > not quite it. OK. Maybe do an appropriate split to give you a little
> > more than you have now, and sell the extra for 30.87... that's in
> > addition to the miscellaneous expense transaction.
>
> > I would be tempted to Sell that sucker, to avoid annual aggravation.

Yes, there's really no good way to deal with this unless you go back
into Quicken and convert your shares into ounces of gold, which would
have other ramifications when it came to daily pricing.

In the SPDR write-up (http://www.spdrgoldshares.com/media/GLD/file/
SPDR-Gold-Trust-Tax-Information-2009.pdf) they are somewhat
inconsistent in their approach to the calculations, but the "Proceeds"
from sales *should* be the same as the "Investment Expense" so that
would leave you with no cash effect, just a slightly smaller number of
ounces of gold. Maybe do a "stock split" to convert to ounces, sell
your ounces, then do a "reverse split" to come back to your original
number of shares?

I haven't received any 1099 info on this but I've read that other
folks who own GLD have received 1099's with each month's sale listed
out as a transaction, meaning each one of those really should be
entered in your tax return. What fun!

Yeah, these sort of things really should be inside an IRA.

Tom Young

Here is what I came up with: (3 transactions)

1. Return of capital of 29.33 which reduces my Cost Basis.
2. Short term gain for 1.54 (Shows up with dividends though instead of the
Capital Gains report)
3. Miscellaneous expense (Investment Expense) of 30.87.


"Art Matz" <> wrote in message
news: m...
>I have a Gold ETF. During the year, no transactions for this ETF were on my
>brokerage statements.
>
> But on my 1099-B detail for this ETF (one month example):
>
> Date Sold = 5/31/09, Qty = 0, Proceeds = 30.87, Cost Basis = 29.33,
> Gain/Loss = 1.54
>
> It also section called Proceeds Investment Expenses - Detail Information
>
> Date = 5/31/09, Amount = 30.87-
>
>
> I was told I could claim the 30.87 as investment expense. Also, the cost
> basis for this position was reduced by the 29.33.
>
> How do I enter a transaction in Q which will reduce my cost basis by
> 29.33, show with a capital gain of 1.54 for 0 shares and investment
> expense of 30.87
> without affecting the number of shares and money in my account?
>
>

I actually tried my suggestion - in a TEST file - of splitting shares
into ounces, selling ounces, creating Investment Expense in the amount
of the sale proceeds ($0 cash effect in account) and then converting
back into shares. I did the first split on 12/30/2009, then entered
the transactions, then did the reverse split on 12/31/2009. Also
adjusted the GLD "share" price on 12/30/2009 to get back to the
correct Market Value on that day. Everything came out OK, though I
had to do a very small "added transaction", at $0 cost, to get back to
the correct number of shares. Everything came out OK, proper gain on
sale, proper basis adjustment, etc., but it sure seems like a lot of
work for very little purpose.

Tom Young


On Mar 4, 1:26*pm, "Art Matz" <am...@invalid.com> wrote:
> Here is what I came up with: (3 transactions)
>
> 1. Return of capital of 29.33 which reduces my Cost Basis.
> 2. Short term gain for 1.54 * (Shows up with dividends though instead of the
> Capital Gains report)
> 3. Miscellaneous expense (Investment Expense) of 30.87.
>
> "Art Matz" <am...@invalid.com> wrote in message
>
> news: m...
>
> >I have a Gold ETF. During the year, no transactions for this ETF were onmy
> >brokerage statements.
>
> > But on my 1099-B detail for this ETF (one month example):
>
> > Date Sold = 5/31/09, *Qty = 0, *Proceeds = 30.87, Cost Basis = 29.33,
> > Gain/Loss = 1.54
>
> > It also section called Proceeds Investment Expenses - Detail Information
>
> > Date = 5/31/09, Amount = 30.87-
>
> > *I was told I could claim the 30.87 as investment expense. Also, the cost
> > basis for this position was reduced by the 29.33.
>
> > How do I enter a transaction in Q which will reduce my cost basis by
> > 29.33, show with a capital gain of 1.54 for 0 shares and investment
> > expense of 30.87
> > without affecting the number of shares and money in my account?

On 3/3/2010 6:55 PM, Art Matz wrote:
> I have a Gold ETF. During the year, no transactions for this ETF were on
> my brokerage statements.
>
> But on my 1099-B detail for this ETF (one month example):
>
> Date Sold = 5/31/09, Qty = 0, Proceeds = 30.87, Cost Basis = 29.33,
> Gain/Loss = 1.54
>
> It also section called Proceeds Investment Expenses - Detail Information
>
> Date = 5/31/09, Amount = 30.87-
>
>
> I was told I could claim the 30.87 as investment expense. Also, the cost
> basis for this position was reduced by the 29.33.
>
> How do I enter a transaction in Q which will reduce my cost basis by
> 29.33, show with a capital gain of 1.54 for 0 shares and investment
> expense of 30.87
> without affecting the number of shares and money in my account?
>
>

Have you searched the IRS.GOV site to see how they recommend handling
this? Then reproduce that in Quicken.

In alt.comp.software.financial.quicken, wrote:

>
>
>Have you searched the IRS.GOV site to see how they recommend handling
>this? Then reproduce that in Quicken.


Good luck with *that*.

On Mar 4, 3:01*pm, "wbert...@teranews.com" <wbert...@rcn.com> wrote:
> On 3/3/2010 6:55 PM, Art Matz wrote:
>
>
>
> > I have a Gold ETF. During the year, no transactions for this ETF were on
> > my brokerage statements.
>
> > But on my 1099-B detail for this ETF (one month example):
>
> > Date Sold = 5/31/09, Qty = 0, Proceeds = 30.87, Cost Basis = 29..33,
> > Gain/Loss = 1.54
>
> > It also section called Proceeds Investment Expenses - Detail Information
>
> > Date = 5/31/09, Amount = 30.87-
>
> > I was told I could claim the 30.87 as investment expense. Also, the cost
> > basis for this position was reduced by the 29.33.
>
> > How do I enter a transaction in Q which will reduce my cost basis by
> > 29.33, show with a capital gain of 1.54 for 0 shares and investment
> > expense of 30.87
> > without affecting the number of shares and money in my account?
>
> Have you searched the IRS.GOV site to see how they recommend handling
> this? *Then reproduce that in Quicken.

The SPDR Gold ETF site has the tax implications well laid out.

http://www.spdrgoldshares.com/media/...ation-2009.pdf

The harder part is making entries in Quicken because you aren't
selling shares, you're selling ounces of gold, and you do have to
adjust your basis as well as report gain or loss. The method I
outlined works, but it's a PITA.

Tom Young