Anyone in this newsgroup give adavice about VAT and the VAT Act 1994?

Discussion in 'UK Accountancy' started by Dave {ð¿ð}, Feb 18, 2007.

  1. I've got different answers each time I've been in contact with HM Revenue
    and Customs (HMRC) :-(

    Here is my dilemma/problem. I am disabled, my left arm is paralysed and in
    order to drive a car legally I require it to be adapted with an infrared
    hand control. Anyway, I've always thought that the supply and fitting of an
    adaption to a car to enable a disabled person to drive was eligible for VAT
    relief. To back this up Notice 701/59 Motor Vehicles for disabled people,
    section 1.3 states that disabled people can get VAT relief on the cost of
    adaptation to suit condition and section 11 also states that an adaption is
    eligible for VAT relief. Further Notice 701/7 VAT reliefs for disabled
    people describes what a disabled person is in
    section 3.2.1 and in section 4.5 states that equipment and appliances
    designed solely for use by disabled people is zero rated. Section 5.1 goes
    on to state that the installation of these goods can also be zero rated.

    I have been in contact with HMRC and I'm a little confused. I was told that
    the supply of the adaption would be free of VAT, but as it was to be fitted
    to a car it would not be VAT free, and so I would have to pay VAT on the
    supply and fitting of the adaption. As I am not a wheelchair or stretcher
    user, I am aware that the car is not free of VAT. But is seems daft that I
    can buy the adaption free of VAT if it were to be used for anything other
    than its intended purpose, but as it is to be fitted to a car in order for
    it to be free of VAT I have to be a wheelchair or stretcher user. How daft
    is that? I think that when they produced Notices 701/59 and 701/7 they got
    a little mixed up as it does not seem to represent what is in Schedule 8,
    Section 30, Group 12 of the Value Added Tax Act 1994.

    Please also note that due to the nature of my disability I am not eligible
    for any help towards the adaption I require. I have to pay for it out of my
    own pocket and my last adaption cost me £1,755 to be supplied and fitted.

    I hope you have not fallen asleep after reading the above :)

    Dave
     
    Dave {ð¿ð}, Feb 18, 2007
    #1
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  2. Dave {ð¿ð}

    Alasdair Guest

    Interesting post.

    I suggest you contact a company which specialises in adapting vehicles
    for disabled people. They are more likely to be familiar with the
    detailed aspects of the relevant legislation than the HMRCE call
    centre people.

    What they say may be correct as VAT is full of stupid anomalies. If I
    buy a roast chicken at a chip shop, I pay VAT but if I buy the same
    thing in a supermarket, I pay no VAT. Work that one out!
     
    Alasdair, Feb 19, 2007
    #2
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  3. Dave {ð¿ð}

    Peter Saxton Guest

    In a chip shop the chicken is hot and meant to be eaten soon but in
    the supermarket it is cold and most likely will be eaten later.
     
    Peter Saxton, Feb 19, 2007
    #3
  4. Not necessarily true. Some supermarkets have a rotisserie counter
    which serves hot chicken in foil lined bags, which is obviously
    intended to be consumed hot.
     
    Graham Murray, Feb 19, 2007
    #4
  5. Dave {ð¿ð}

    Tumbleweed Guest

    Why 'obviously'? maybe the bags are there to protect the rest of your
    shopping from the hot food, or at least could be used for that.
     
    Tumbleweed, Feb 19, 2007
    #5
  6. The reason it's obvious is because if the intention were not for
    it to be eaten hot, then they wouldn't need the rotisserie counter,
    they could just sell the chilled pre-roasted stuff (which they do
    already anyway).
     
    Ronald Raygun, Feb 19, 2007
    #6
  7. Dave {ð¿ð}

    Alasdair Guest

    Not so. In our local Sainsbury's, the chicken is piping hot and kept
    so in a heated display cabinet.
     
    Alasdair, Feb 19, 2007
    #7
  8. In which case you have to pay VAT on it, if it is sold with the intention
    that it is eaten while still hot.
     
    Jonathan Bryce, Feb 19, 2007
    #8
  9. Dave {ð¿ð}

    Peter Saxton Guest

    What makes you think there's no VAT charged?
     
    Peter Saxton, Feb 19, 2007
    #9
  10. Dave {ð¿ð}

    Tumbleweed Guest

    but this way you get an option to have it hot, plus you know its freshly
    cooked even if you'll have it cold in an hour.
     
    Tumbleweed, Feb 19, 2007
    #10
  11. Dave {ð¿ð}

    Nogood Boyo Guest

    Quite. Cold take-away food is zero-rated but not hot take-away food.
    I'd be surprised if the supermarket zero-rates hot freshly cooked
    chickens.
     
    Nogood Boyo, Feb 20, 2007
    #11
  12. Dave {ð¿ð}

    Nogood Boyo Guest

    You've obviously read the relevant HMRC guidance and the law. If the
    guidance in 701/7 and 701/59 is not clear or inconsistent, the last
    thing you should rely on is the verbal advice of someone in HMRC. You
    should put to HMRC in writing the points which you have set out here and
    request a written ruling. If the ruling suits you, go with it. If you
    still think it's wrong, dispute the ruling and request a reconsideration
    until you get an explanation / ruling which you can accept as being
    consistent with the law. Although they try really hard, they don't
    always get their guidance right. When they get it wrong, it's usually
    because of an attempt to dumb down the draft written by the technical
    expert.
     
    Nogood Boyo, Feb 20, 2007
    #12
  13. Dave {ð¿ð}

    Miss L. Toe Guest

    How do you know that it wasnt first cooked last week off-site in controlled
    conditions then simply warmed up in this rotisserie ?
     
    Miss L. Toe, Feb 20, 2007
    #13
  14. You don't, but that's not important. The important thing is you
    have to pay VAT for the dubious privilege.
     
    Ronald Raygun, Feb 20, 2007
    #14
  15. Speaking of being clear and consistent, would it not have been better
    to have phrased the above as ".. is unclear or inconsistent .."?
    Otherwise the "not" might be taken to apply both to "clear" and to
    "inconsistent" instead of just to "clear".

    :-]
     
    Ronald Raygun, Feb 20, 2007
    #15
  16. Dave {ð¿ð}

    Miss L. Toe Guest

    Can you get a rebate if you put it next to the ice cream in your trolley and
    it cools down by the time you get to the checkout (and melts the ice cream)
    ?
     
    Miss L. Toe, Feb 20, 2007
    #16
  17. Dave {ð¿ð}

    Nogood Boyo Guest

    Yes dear...
     
    Nogood Boyo, Feb 20, 2007
    #17
  18. Dave {ð¿ð}

    Tumbleweed Guest

    I think there is a special Euro VAT refund form for that exact occurrence
     
    Tumbleweed, Feb 20, 2007
    #18
  19. Just to follow this up. I've now had a written reply from HMRC and they
    state that the adaption is zero VAT rated :)

    Dave
     
    Dave {ð¿ð}, Feb 21, 2007
    #19
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