Verified by Visa - is this optional???????


C

Chris K

I spend ££££52 gazillion per year on web - Never really had problem

Of late Debit/Credit cards having been trying to persuade me to sign up for
some extra online security feature that will basically shorten my life by
one hour everytime i buy something

So far there has been a box saying "not at this time" - which i click,
finish my purchase and carry on with my otherwise pedestrian life

Just tried to buy game from Tesco, and after spending 3 weeks creating new
account and entering all my card details, etc, yaaaaaaaaaawn! i tried to
checkout and was greeted with:


"Authentication Required For Purchase"
"Your card can be registered now for Verified by Visa - a new, free security
service to help prevent unauthorised use of this card when shopping online.
It is required for this purchase, which cannot be made without it."

"Complete the form below [...and die of boredom]"


Although the operative word is still in use here "card ****CAN***
be registered"

It wont let me complete the purchase without completing the form - so in
fact they mean "card ****MUST*** be registered"

Slip of the tongue maybe - hope someone slips a mallet into the head of the
poster of this big brother message

Question: Is online verification now compulsory or still supposedly
optional?????????


P.S. Oh yeah - cancelled the purchase and bought game from play.com instead
 
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M

Mark Opolo

Chris K said:
I spend ££££52 gazillion per year on web - Never really had problem

Of late Debit/Credit cards having been trying to persuade me to sign up
for some extra online security feature that will basically shorten my life
by one hour everytime i buy something

So far there has been a box saying "not at this time" - which i click,
finish my purchase and carry on with my otherwise pedestrian life

Just tried to buy game from Tesco, and after spending 3 weeks creating new
account and entering all my card details, etc, yaaaaaaaaaawn! i tried to
checkout and was greeted with:


"Authentication Required For Purchase"
"Your card can be registered now for Verified by Visa - a new, free
security service to help prevent unauthorised use of this card when
shopping online. It is required for this purchase, which cannot be made
without it."

"Complete the form below [...and die of boredom]"


Although the operative word is still in use here "card ****CAN*** be
registered"

It wont let me complete the purchase without completing the form - so in
fact they mean "card ****MUST*** be registered"

Slip of the tongue maybe - hope someone slips a mallet into the head of
the poster of this big brother message

Question: Is online verification now compulsory or still supposedly
optional?????????


P.S. Oh yeah - cancelled the purchase and bought game from play.com
instead
I use Verification on my MasterCard and it adds 10 seconds to a
purchase...........you just have to enter a password.
 
M

Maria

I spend ££££52 gazillion per year on web - Never really had problem

Of late Debit/Credit cards having been trying to persuade me to sign up
for some extra online security feature that will basically shorten my
life by one hour everytime i buy something

So far there has been a box saying "not at this time" - which i click,
finish my purchase and carry on with my otherwise pedestrian life

Just tried to buy game from Tesco, and after spending 3 weeks creating
new account and entering all my card details, etc, yaaaaaaaaaawn! i
tried to checkout and was greeted with:


"Authentication Required For Purchase"
"Your card can be registered now for Verified by Visa - a new, free
security service to help prevent unauthorised use of this card when
shopping online. It is required for this purchase, which cannot be made
without it."

"Complete the form below [...and die of boredom]"


Although the operative word is still in use here "card ****CAN*** be
registered"

It wont let me complete the purchase without completing the form - so in
fact they mean "card ****MUST*** be registered"

Slip of the tongue maybe - hope someone slips a mallet into the head of
the poster of this big brother message

Question: Is online verification now compulsory or still supposedly
optional?????????
No. It's 'optional' on my site, but I have to pay a monthly fee to the
merchant for that privilege - I figured I'd be better off not losing the
sales...
 
D

David Woolley

Chris said:
So far there has been a box saying "not at this time" - which i click,
finish my purchase and carry on with my otherwise pedestrian life
I believe you are only allowed to defer three (two?) times.

Please be careful with 3D Secure services, like this. Neither the banks
nor the merchants seem to understand how to operate them securely.

Firstly, ignore the confirmation phrase that you supply, unless it
really is wrong. It is a trivial man in the middle attack to obtain
this. Next check that the frame or page really is coming from your bank.

On the second point, there are two problems. Firstly some banks use the
US company, who operate the service's, domain name on the form page. As
it is unlikely that your bank has told you this over a secure channel,
and unlikely that their first line support people will understand the
problem, you are on your own in ensuring that the source of the page
really is trustworthy in relation to your bank.

The second problem is that some organisations, including, at least an
one time, British Gas, and a major card processing service, really do go
man in the middle, and send the form from their site. Unless you are an
expert in HTML and Javascript, it will be difficult to be sure that what
you submit has gone directly to your bank, and certain that someone
other than your bank has had access to the confirmation phrase. You
cannot rely on the fact that your browser says the form will submit
directly to the bank, as this can be changed by scripting, after you
press the script button.

Even where they don't embed the form in their own page, they will often
try to obscure its origins using IFRAME, making checking a hassle.

My policy is that, if I am unable to verify that the form has come
directly from the bank, or their known 3D Secure agents, I will either
abort the transaction, or change the password, immediately after the
transaction.

I believe the card processing service I mentioned, now does things properly.

Retailers tend to be held responsible for chargebacks if 3D Secure is
not in effect, and customers tend not to be able to make them if it is
in effect.
 
R

Ret.

Mark said:
Chris K said:
I spend ££££52 gazillion per year on web - Never really had problem

Of late Debit/Credit cards having been trying to persuade me to sign
up for some extra online security feature that will basically
shorten my life by one hour everytime i buy something

So far there has been a box saying "not at this time" - which i
click, finish my purchase and carry on with my otherwise pedestrian
life Just tried to buy game from Tesco, and after spending 3 weeks
creating new account and entering all my card details, etc,
yaaaaaaaaaawn! i tried to checkout and was greeted with:


"Authentication Required For Purchase"
"Your card can be registered now for Verified by Visa - a new, free
security service to help prevent unauthorised use of this card when
shopping online. It is required for this purchase, which cannot be
made without it."

"Complete the form below [...and die of boredom]"


Although the operative word is still in use here "card ****CAN***
be registered"

It wont let me complete the purchase without completing the form -
so in fact they mean "card ****MUST*** be registered"

Slip of the tongue maybe - hope someone slips a mallet into the head
of the poster of this big brother message

Question: Is online verification now compulsory or still supposedly
optional?????????


P.S. Oh yeah - cancelled the purchase and bought game from play.com
instead
I use Verification on my MasterCard and it adds 10 seconds to a
purchase...........you just have to enter a password.
And not even the full password!
 
M

Martin

Chris said:
I spend ££££52 gazillion per year on web - Never really had problem

Of late Debit/Credit cards having been trying to persuade me to sign up
for some extra online security feature that will basically shorten my
life by one hour everytime i buy something

So far there has been a box saying "not at this time" - which i click,
finish my purchase and carry on with my otherwise pedestrian life

Just tried to buy game from Tesco, and after spending 3 weeks creating
new account and entering all my card details, etc, yaaaaaaaaaawn! i
tried to checkout and was greeted with:


"Authentication Required For Purchase"
"Your card can be registered now for Verified by Visa - a new, free
security service to help prevent unauthorised use of this card when
shopping online. It is required for this purchase, which cannot be made
without it."

"Complete the form below [...and die of boredom]"


Although the operative word is still in use here "card ****CAN*** be
registered"

It wont let me complete the purchase without completing the form - so in
fact they mean "card ****MUST*** be registered"

Slip of the tongue maybe - hope someone slips a mallet into the head of
the poster of this big brother message

Question: Is online verification now compulsory or still supposedly
optional?????????


P.S. Oh yeah - cancelled the purchase and bought game from play.com instead
What the **** are you on about?
 
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T

tim....

Mark Opolo said:
Chris K said:
I spend ££££52 gazillion per year on web - Never really had problem

Of late Debit/Credit cards having been trying to persuade me to sign up
for some extra online security feature that will basically shorten my
life by one hour everytime i buy something

So far there has been a box saying "not at this time" - which i click,
finish my purchase and carry on with my otherwise pedestrian life

Just tried to buy game from Tesco, and after spending 3 weeks creating
new account and entering all my card details, etc, yaaaaaaaaaawn! i tried
to checkout and was greeted with:


"Authentication Required For Purchase"
"Your card can be registered now for Verified by Visa - a new, free
security service to help prevent unauthorised use of this card when
shopping online. It is required for this purchase, which cannot be made
without it."

"Complete the form below [...and die of boredom]"


Although the operative word is still in use here "card ****CAN*** be
registered"

It wont let me complete the purchase without completing the form - so in
fact they mean "card ****MUST*** be registered"

Slip of the tongue maybe - hope someone slips a mallet into the head of
the poster of this big brother message

Question: Is online verification now compulsory or still supposedly
optional?????????


P.S. Oh yeah - cancelled the purchase and bought game from play.com
instead
I use Verification on my MasterCard and it adds 10 seconds to a
purchase...........you just have to enter a password.
I'm asked so rarely I've forgotten it,

so then I have to go through the rigmarole of resetting it.

A right PITA

Of course, I could write it down :-(

tim
 
J

johannes

Chris said:
I spend ££££52 gazillion per year on web - Never really had problem

Of late Debit/Credit cards having been trying to persuade me to sign up for
some extra online security feature that will basically shorten my life by
one hour everytime i buy something

So far there has been a box saying "not at this time" - which i click,
finish my purchase and carry on with my otherwise pedestrian life

Just tried to buy game from Tesco, and after spending 3 weeks creating new
account and entering all my card details, etc, yaaaaaaaaaawn! i tried to
checkout and was greeted with:

"Authentication Required For Purchase"
"Your card can be registered now for Verified by Visa - a new, free security
service to help prevent unauthorised use of this card when shopping online.
It is required for this purchase, which cannot be made without it."

"Complete the form below [...and die of boredom]"

Although the operative word is still in use here "card ****CAN***
be registered"

It wont let me complete the purchase without completing the form - so in
fact they mean "card ****MUST*** be registered"

Slip of the tongue maybe - hope someone slips a mallet into the head of the
poster of this big brother message

Question: Is online verification now compulsory or still supposedly
optional?????????

P.S. Oh yeah - cancelled the purchase and bought game from play.com instead
Depends on the internet retailer; some use it, some don't. I don't see any
problem with extra security.
 
D

David Woolley

Maria said:
No. It's 'optional' on my site, but I have to pay a monthly fee to the
merchant for that privilege - I figured I'd be better off not losing the
sales...
I think the situation is that the 3D Secure operators will only give you
a limited number of attempts to register before they will refuse to
authorise, but the merchant always has the discretion to accept the
transaction, even if 3D Secure is rejected by the customer.

Some have chosen not to use it at all, but others think the risk of
having to fund the cost of fraud is too high.

If it had been implemented competently, I would have welcomed it, as it
would have limited my liability to the value of one transaction, when
dealing with a suspect trader (e.g. overseas). However, as implemented,
it is simply a get out of debt free card for the banks.

Currently PayPal solves the problem of limiting risk to one transaction,
but, apparently, their terms for merchants, particularly the time to
payment, discourage a lot of merchants from using them.
 
D

David Woolley

johannes said:
Depends on the internet retailer; some use it, some don't. I don't see any
problem with extra security.
As implemented, it doesn't add security, but does give the banks an
excuse to reject claims that your card was used fraudulently. It could
be secure, if they taught people how to use the security in their
browsers properly and insisted that the form be served, unframed,
directly from a site with an SSL certificate for the bank. However
merchants like to present a seamless interface, where their payment
agents and banks don't appear overtly.

The confirmation phrase is snake oil. Anyone with your basic card
details can get it.
 
M

Maria

Chris said:
I spend ££££52 gazillion per year on web - Never really had problem

Of late Debit/Credit cards having been trying to persuade me to sign up for
some extra online security feature that will basically shorten my life by
one hour everytime i buy something

So far there has been a box saying "not at this time" - which i click,
finish my purchase and carry on with my otherwise pedestrian life

Just tried to buy game from Tesco, and after spending 3 weeks creating new
account and entering all my card details, etc, yaaaaaaaaaawn! i tried to
checkout and was greeted with:

"Authentication Required For Purchase"
"Your card can be registered now for Verified by Visa - a new, free security
service to help prevent unauthorised use of this card when shopping online.
It is required for this purchase, which cannot be made without it

"Complete the form below [...and die of boredom]"

Although the operative word is still in use here "card ****CAN***
be registered"

It wont let me complete the purchase without completing the form - so in
fact they mean "card ****MUST*** be registered"

Slip of the tongue maybe - hope someone slips a mallet into the head of the
poster of this big brother message

Question: Is online verification now compulsory or still supposedly
optional?????????

P.S. Oh yeah - cancelled the purchase and bought game from play.com instead
Depends on the internet retailer; some use it, some don't. I don't see any
problem with extra security.
It was optional to retailers at no cost until a few months ago - now
it's only optional if the retailer pays extra monthly fee to the
merchant bank. I guess that sooner or later it won't be optional at all.
 
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J

Justin Credible

David Woolley said:
The confirmation phrase is snake oil. Anyone with your basic card details
can get it.
One-off dynamic card numbers would do away with the whole thing?
 
M

Mark Opolo

tim.... said:
Mark Opolo said:
Chris K said:
I spend ££££52 gazillion per year on web - Never really had problem

Of late Debit/Credit cards having been trying to persuade me to sign up
for some extra online security feature that will basically shorten my
life by one hour everytime i buy something

So far there has been a box saying "not at this time" - which i click,
finish my purchase and carry on with my otherwise pedestrian life

Just tried to buy game from Tesco, and after spending 3 weeks creating
new account and entering all my card details, etc, yaaaaaaaaaawn! i
tried to checkout and was greeted with:


"Authentication Required For Purchase"
"Your card can be registered now for Verified by Visa - a new, free
security service to help prevent unauthorised use of this card when
shopping online. It is required for this purchase, which cannot be made
without it."

"Complete the form below [...and die of boredom]"


Although the operative word is still in use here "card ****CAN*** be
registered"

It wont let me complete the purchase without completing the form - so in
fact they mean "card ****MUST*** be registered"

Slip of the tongue maybe - hope someone slips a mallet into the head of
the poster of this big brother message

Question: Is online verification now compulsory or still supposedly
optional?????????


P.S. Oh yeah - cancelled the purchase and bought game from play.com
instead
I use Verification on my MasterCard and it adds 10 seconds to a
purchase...........you just have to enter a password.
I'm asked so rarely I've forgotten it,

so then I have to go through the rigmarole of resetting it.

A right PITA

Of course, I could write it down :-(

tim
ABCDEFG...:)
 
S

S

As implemented, it doesn't add security, but does give the banks an
excuse to reject claims that your card was used fraudulently.
Exactly.

 It could
be secure, if they taught people how to use the security in their
browsers properly and insisted that the form be served, unframed,
directly from a site with an SSL certificate for the bank. However
merchants like to present a seamless interface, where their payment
agents and banks don't appear overtly.

The confirmation phrase is snake oil.  Anyone with your basic card
details can get it.
I could not agree more. In one case I only needed my birthday in
addition to my card number to set a new VbV password.
 
T

Tim Woodall

Retailers tend to be held responsible for chargebacks if 3D Secure is
not in effect, and customers tend not to be able to make them if it is
in effect.
I have this problem - I have no idea where the problem lies but it's
related to my card(s) because it happens to me on multiple different
browsers on different machines and yet my girlfriend using my login at
home managed to buy using her card without a problem.

But, I've found that provided you disable Javascript just before you
"buy" then the VbV stuff does seem to work. GNER/National Express/East
Coast has had this problem for ages - and now I've found that Ocado has
the same problem.

It has also been carefully engineered to be indistinguishable from a
phishing attack. In fact, I think the reason Ocado fails is because
Firefox/NoScript blocks some of the Javascript thinking it's a cross
site scripting attack. (I've only ordered from Ocado once, next time
I'll watch more closely to see what happens)

Tim.
 
T

Theo Markettos

In uk.finance Chris K said:
Question: Is online verification now compulsory or still supposedly
optional?????????
Card issuers can turn it off. It's possible to have a card that skips the
VbV/3DS step (the browser might bounce you to the VbV site, but it'll bounce
straight back again to the website you were paying).

Theo
 
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C

Chris K

Martin said:
Chris said:
I spend ££££52 gazillion per year on web - Never really had problem

Of late Debit/Credit cards having been trying to persuade me to sign up
for some extra online security feature that will basically shorten my
life by one hour everytime i buy something

So far there has been a box saying "not at this time" - which i click,
finish my purchase and carry on with my otherwise pedestrian life

Just tried to buy game from Tesco, and after spending 3 weeks creating
new account and entering all my card details, etc, yaaaaaaaaaawn! i tried
to checkout and was greeted with:


"Authentication Required For Purchase"
"Your card can be registered now for Verified by Visa - a new, free
security service to help prevent unauthorised use of this card when
shopping online. It is required for this purchase, which cannot be made
without it."

"Complete the form below [...and die of boredom]"


Although the operative word is still in use here "card ****CAN*** be
registered"

It wont let me complete the purchase without completing the form - so in
fact they mean "card ****MUST*** be registered"

Slip of the tongue maybe - hope someone slips a mallet into the head of
the poster of this big brother message

Question: Is online verification now compulsory or still supposedly
optional?????????


P.S. Oh yeah - cancelled the purchase and bought game from play.com
instead
What the **** are you on about?
Just told you donkey
 
C

Chris K

Depends on the internet retailer; some use it, some don't. I don't see any
problem with extra security.
Great - so long as I steer clear of Tesco in future i wont get harassed -
shame - i have used them loads times before and they'r getting competitive -
oh hum
 
M

Max Demian

Mark Opolo wrote:

And not even the full password!
And if you get it wrong three times in a row they just ask you to
supply a new one. The only security information they require is stuff
on your card plus your date of birth (which is all they ask for in the
first place).

So anyone who has stolen (or even just got a good look at) your card
and knows your birthday and how old you are can sign themselves up for
it and make purchases in your name.

As a security measure against fraud it's pathetic.
 
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A

Alan

johannes said:
Depends on the internet retailer; some use it, some don't. I don't see any
problem with extra security.
But it's not "extra" security for you. After giving all your details to
a retailer a Verified by Visa phising page comes up asking for more
details.
 

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